[Davical-general] poor documentation

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[Davical-general] poor documentation

Ed Harkess
I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.
I would have been more than happy to write documentation, but after 50
actual hours of trying, I give up on my debian jessie.
  postgresql ok;
  apache2 ok;
  the next step?.

please delete /remove /forget me "ed harx".

I'll look for an equivalent or hack something, or use post-it notes.

--

  met vriendelijke groeten
    Ed Harkess
    St-Sebastiaanstraat 41A
    B-3560 Lummen
     tel +32 11 215 919


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Re: poor documentation

tom wible

On Aug 7, 2015, at 6:28 PM, Ed Harkess <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.

well now u know why some ppl spell it open-sores s/w;-/

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Re: poor documentation

Ed Harkess
In reply to this post by Ed Harkess
Tres etrange, vous n'avez pas donné votre route de/du/ success? Ou est
votre chaine de documentation? En francais est d'accord!

  met vriendelijke groeten
    Ed Harkess
    St-Sebastiaanstraat 41A
    B-3560 Lummen
     tel +32 11 215 919

On 08/08/15 00:57, Pierre Couderc wrote:

> Strange, I am new to davical, but I had no problem with it. And even
> with nginx...
>
>
> On 08/08/2015 12:28 AM, Ed Harkess wrote:
>> I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.
>> I would have been more than happy to write documentation, but after 50
>> actual hours of trying, I give up on my debian jessie.
>>    postgresql ok;
>>    apache2 ok;
>>    the next step?.
>>
>> please delete /remove /forget me "ed harx".
>>
>> I'll look for an equivalent or hack something, or use post-it notes.
>>
>
>


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Re: poor documentation

Andrew Ruthven
In reply to this post by Ed Harkess
Hi Ed,

Sorry to hear about your frustrations. This is one area where being
experienced with the software can make it hard to write docs. How far
did you get along http://www.davical.org/installation.php ?

Cheers,
Andrew

On Sat, 2015-08-08 at 00:28 +0200, Ed Harkess wrote:

> I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.
> I would have been more than happy to write documentation, but after 50
> actual hours of trying, I give up on my debian jessie.
>   postgresql ok;
>   apache2 ok;
>   the next step?.
>
> please delete /remove /forget me "ed harx".
>
> I'll look for an equivalent or hack something, or use post-it notes.
>

--
Andrew Ruthven, Wellington, New Zealand
[hidden email]             |     linux.conf.au 2016
  New Zealand's only Cloud:   | LCA By the Bay, Geelong, AU
https://catalyst.net.nz/cloud | http://lca2016.linux.org.au




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Re: poor documentation

Narcis Garcia - GiLUG
In reply to this post by Ed Harkess
http://wiki.davical.org/index.php/Debian_shared


El 08/08/15 a les 02:59, Andrew Ruthven ha escrit:

> Hi Ed,
>
> Sorry to hear about your frustrations. This is one area where being
> experienced with the software can make it hard to write docs. How far
> did you get along http://www.davical.org/installation.php ?
>
> Cheers,
> Andrew
>
> On Sat, 2015-08-08 at 00:28 +0200, Ed Harkess wrote:
>> I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.
>> I would have been more than happy to write documentation, but after 50
>> actual hours of trying, I give up on my debian jessie.
>>   postgresql ok;
>>   apache2 ok;
>>   the next step?.
>>
>> please delete /remove /forget me "ed harx".
>>
>> I'll look for an equivalent or hack something, or use post-it notes.
>>
>

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Re: poor documentation

Cyril Giraud-2
In reply to this post by Ed Harkess
On 08/08/2015 00:28, Ed Harkess wrote:

> I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.
> I would have been more than happy to write documentation, but after 50
> actual hours of trying, I give up on my debian jessie.
>    postgresql ok;
>    apache2 ok;
>    the next step?.
>
> please delete /remove /forget me "ed harx".
>
> I'll look for an equivalent or hack something, or use post-it notes.
>

Yes, documentation and installation scripts could be improved but Jessie
installation seems very easy to me (around 2 hours reading documentation):
. download .iso:
http://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/8.1.0/i386/iso-cd/debian-8.1.0-i386-netinst.iso
. For testing purpose, and because I don't want to brake my current
UbuntuStudio, a have created a new VirtualBox Virtual Machine, 128 MB
RAM, 3GB VDI disk, Bridge Network with local IP assigned by my ADSL box.
. I booted this new machine on downloaded .iso and follow debian
standard installation, only base system + ssh + reboot (account davical
+ root)
. apt-get install davical [root]
. from LAN, browse http://192.168.0.18 ==> Apache2 Debian Default Page [ok]
. looking at http://www.davical.org/installation.php §Database Setup
    - vi /etc/postgresql/9.4/main/pg_hba.conf and add 2 davical lines [root]
    - service postgresql restart [root] (missing in documentation)
    - su postgres -c /usr/share/davical/dba/create-database.sh
  [root]
. looking at http://www.davical.org/installation.php §Apache Configuration
    - cd /etc/www; ln -s /usr/share/davical/htdocs davical
    - cd /etc/apache2; cp -p sites-available/000-default.conf
sites-available/010-davical.conf; vi sites-available/010-davical.conf
--> s/html/davical/
    - a2dissite 000-default
    - a2ensite 010-davical
    - service apache2 reload
    --> from LAN, reload http://192.168.0.18 ==> DaviCal Not Configured [ok]
. looking at http://www.davical.org/installation.php §DAViCal Configuration
    - vi /etc/davical/config.php to configure $c->admin_email,
pg_connect[] and default_locale (example: $c->default_locale =
'fr_FR.UTF-8';)
    --> from LAN, reload http://192.168.0.18 ==> Log On Please [ok]
. looking at http://www.davical.org/installation.php §Completed?
    - su postgres -c "psql davical -c 'select username, password from usr;'"
    - from LAN, log on with admin and password ==> enjoy DaviCal!

Could you repport us your problem ?

        Cyril.


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Re: poor documentation

tom wible


On Aug 9, 2015, at 6:52 AM, Cyril Giraud <[hidden email]> wrote:

> - vi /etc/postgresql/9.4/main/pg_hba.conf and add 2 davical lines [root]
>    - service postgresql restart [root] (missing in documentation)

thus illustrating the disconect between the opensores s/w gurus

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Re: poor documentation

tom wible


On Aug 9, 2015, at 6:52 AM, Cyril Giraud <[hidden email]> wrote:

- vi /etc/postgresql/9.4/main/pg_hba.conf and add 2 davical lines [root]
  - service postgresql restart [root] (missing in documentation)

thus illustrating the disconnect between the opensores* s/w gurus who just know that when u change a service config file of course u have to bounce the service why bother mentioning it and the muggles

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Re: poor documentation

tom wible
sorry about the multiple partial posts
damn tiny phone kbd 

On Aug 9, 2015, at 6:52 AM, Cyril Giraud <[hidden email]> wrote:

- vi /etc/postgresql/9.4/main/pg_hba.conf and add 2 davical lines [root]
  - service postgresql restart [root] (missing in documentation)

thus illustrating the disconnect between the gurus who just know that when u change a service config file of course u have to bounce* the service why bother mentioning it in the documentation 
and the muggles** who try to follow the docs without the just knowing part;-} 

and that's why they call it opensores*** s/w;-)

* down then up
** xref harry potter;-)
***  slur of pronunciation in english of open source  ;-) jk

just in case you didn't know that;-)


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Re: poor documentation

Jim Seymour
In reply to this post by Ed Harkess
On Sat, 08 Aug 2015 00:28:03 +0200
Ed Harkess <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I have given up trying to get davical implemented on a LAN.
> I would have been more than happy to write documentation, but after
> 50 actual hours of trying, I give up on my debian jessie.
[snip]

Instead of a rant, Ed, you might try:

    Help!  I've been trying to get DAViCal running on a LAN.

    Here's what I have...

    Here's what's (not) happening...

    Can somebody help me get this going?

    Thanks,
    Ed

I understand the frustration.  Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
But what you're doing is not the way to get help... or sympathy.

FWIW: I got DAViCal 1.1.3.1 installed on our outside mailserver,
*including* porting an existing database with between 75 and 100
calendar users, up and running in probably less than an hour, all
total.

I was pleasantly surprised at how smoothly it went.

Regards,
Jim
--
Note: My mail server employs *very* aggressive anti-spam
filtering.  If you reply to this email and your email is
rejected, please accept my apologies and let me know via my
web form at <http://jimsun.LinxNet.com/contact/scform.php>.

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Re: poor documentation

Jim Seymour
In reply to this post by tom wible
On Sun, 9 Aug 2015 07:48:24 -0400
tom wible <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> > On Aug 9, 2015, at 6:52 AM, Cyril Giraud <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > - vi /etc/postgresql/9.4/main/pg_hba.conf and add 2 davical lines
> > [root]
> >   - service postgresql restart [root] (missing in documentation)
>
> thus illustrating the disconnect between the opensores* s/w gurus who
> just know that when u change a service config file of course u have
> to bounce the service why bother mentioning it and the muggles

You mean as opposed to say, MS Win, where you have to bounce the entire
server?

Yeah: That's much mo bettah.

Regards,
Jim
--
Note: My mail server employs *very* aggressive anti-spam
filtering.  If you reply to this email and your email is
rejected, please accept my apologies and let me know via my
web form at <http://jimsun.LinxNet.com/contact/scform.php>.

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Re: poor documentation

tom wible
Jim Seymour wrote:

> On Sun, 9 Aug 2015 07:48:24 -0400
> tom wible <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> On Aug 9, 2015, at 6:52 AM, Cyril Giraud <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> - vi /etc/postgresql/9.4/main/pg_hba.conf and add 2 davical lines
>>> [root]
>>>    - service postgresql restart [root] (missing in documentation)
>> thus illustrating the disconnect between the opensores* s/w gurus who
>> just know that when u change a service config file of course u have
>> to bounce the service why bother mentioning it and the muggles
> You mean as opposed to say, MS Win, where you have to bounce the entire
> server?
>
> Yeah: That's much mo bettah.
what part of "muggles" don't u understand?-)

sorry if u missed my point: the problem w/oss is the arrogance and snark# of the
l33t crowd toward those trying to follow poorly documented procedures...this is
common in but not exclusive to the online world, and is part&parcel of the
broader coarsening of, well, the world:-\ case in point: the donald*-)

# of which i'm also guilty;-}
* donald trump, republican clown-in-chief, for those living outside the u.s. &|
in a cave;-)

RUN DONNIEBOY RUN!!! pull a perot!



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Re: poor documentation

Jim Fenton
On 08/11/2015 05:59 AM, tom wible wrote:
> sorry if u missed my point: the problem w/oss is the arrogance and snark# of the
> l33t crowd toward those trying to follow poorly documented procedures...this is
> common in but not exclusive to the online world, and is part&parcel of the
> broader coarsening of, well, the world:-\ case in point: the donald*-)
>
>
Tom (and others),

Please bear in mind that we are all volunteers here. I am trying to help
out here, not because I think I'm leet or something, but because I
installed DAViCal a few years ago to manage my family's calendars, and
it has served us well so I want to give back something to the effort.

The installation documentation is often the hardest to do, because
installation from scratch isn't something that most of us frequently do.
Perhaps we should be setting up virtual machines and doing that more
often, but then again we are volunteers.

With respect to Cyril's comment that restarting postgresql isn't in the
documentation, it does say at http://www.davical.org/installation.php :

> Once you have changed the pg_hba.conf file you will need to reload or
> restart the PostgreSQL process for the change to come into effect.

The specifics of how to do that depend on which operating system you're
on, and this page is trying to stay general.

We recognize that DAViCal can't meet everyone's needs. Feel free to use
an alternative if it doesn't meet yours.

-Jim


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Re: poor documentation

Scott Balneaves
In reply to this post by tom wible
On Tue, Aug 11, 2015 at 08:59:29AM -0400, tom wible wrote:

> sorry if u missed my point: the problem w/oss is the arrogance and snark# of the
> l33t crowd toward those trying to follow poorly documented procedures...this is
> common in but not exclusive to the online world, and is part&parcel of the
> broader coarsening of, well, the world:-\ case in point: the donald*-)

Many people seem to misunderstand the nature of people who write free and open
source software.  The vast majority of us who write, or contribute to, the
software are not here to solve your problems - we're here to solve OUR
problems, and we are happy to make our contributions public, in the altruistic
hope that it may also solve your problems, as well.  If a given piece
of software does not meet your needs, your options are:

1) Take responsibility for your problems, contribute to the software to fix
   your problem, and help.
2) Take responsibility for your problems, and find an alternative software
   package that DOES meet your needs.

Please note that in both scenarios, you must take responsibility for your own
problems.  Accusing volunteers who do not get paid to solve your problems of
being a "l33t crowd" who give you "arrogance and snark#" because they do not
trip over themselves to solve YOUR problems over which YOU are responsible is
not likely to win you many fans.

Scott

--
Today is the first day of the rest of the mess.
  -- Anonymous

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